Comments on: Open Source – The Real iPhone Killer http://www.nixiepixel.com/open-source-phone/ All Your Base - Now Blog to Us Thu, 09 Sep 2010 09:51:37 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.0.1 By: BigWhale http://www.nixiepixel.com/open-source-phone/comment-page-1/#comment-3098 BigWhale Sat, 13 Mar 2010 08:49:19 +0000 http://www.nixiepixel.com/?p=972#comment-3098 No, some competition is ok, too much competition will hurt users. Imagine having 20 'one man band' projects instead of 4 projects each with five people on it. Multiple desktop environments? Fine but each having its own sound server and solution for playing sound? Running KDE application in Gnome requires a bunch of KDE processes in the background. If you're writing application that deals with sound you'll have to decide what to support. Alsa? Pulseaudio? Arts? Oldschool esd and oss? We don't need three different API's to deal with hardware, we need one. Low level stuff needs to be standardized and unified so that higher level stuff can offer interoperability and developers don't need to decide who their target audience is. Too much competition doesn't lower prices for open source users it usually lowers the quality since developers are scatered. No, some competition is ok, too much competition will hurt users. Imagine having 20 ‘one man band’ projects instead of 4 projects each with five people on it.

Multiple desktop environments? Fine but each having its own sound server and solution for playing sound?

Running KDE application in Gnome requires a bunch of KDE processes in the background. If you’re writing application that deals with sound you’ll have to decide what to support. Alsa? Pulseaudio? Arts? Oldschool esd and oss?

We don’t need three different API’s to deal with hardware, we need one.

Low level stuff needs to be standardized and unified so that higher level stuff can offer interoperability and developers don’t need to decide who their target audience is.

Too much competition doesn’t lower prices for open source users it usually lowers the quality since developers are scatered.

]]> By: Silvanus http://www.nixiepixel.com/open-source-phone/comment-page-1/#comment-3078 Silvanus Mon, 08 Mar 2010 16:09:00 +0000 http://www.nixiepixel.com/?p=972#comment-3078 "Some competition is ok, but not too much" > I'm sorry, I just cannot sympathise with that. I really do not get your chicken. The more competition, the better! There are always a few that stand out in the open source world, and are ready for you to use even if you are not experienced; for example, in the window manager world, there are KDE and Gnome. There being a large choice of distribution doesn't hurt at all. They share with each other (sometimes..), more approaches are used. There are always a few 'standard', popular distributions you can more-or-less rely on, but still a lot of innovation. “Some competition is ok, but not too much”
> I’m sorry, I just cannot sympathise with that. I really do not get your chicken. The more competition, the better! There are always a few that stand out in the open source world, and are ready for you to use even if you are not experienced; for example, in the window manager world, there are KDE and Gnome. There being a large choice of distribution doesn’t hurt at all. They share with each other (sometimes..), more approaches are used. There are always a few ‘standard’, popular distributions you can more-or-less rely on, but still a lot of innovation.

]]> By: Silvanus http://www.nixiepixel.com/open-source-phone/comment-page-1/#comment-3077 Silvanus Mon, 08 Mar 2010 15:55:22 +0000 http://www.nixiepixel.com/?p=972#comment-3077 What about security certificate/digital signature technology? There is no good reason Apple needs to completely control the devices it sells. And as for viruses & shizzle, Macs & popular Linux distros 'just work'. If a platform is well designed, expensive 3rd party security software shouldn't be necessary. I would rather an open market, and be required to use some common sense, than a closed market mothered by Apple that has only one porn genre. I think the average luser is ready for that. What about security certificate/digital signature technology? There is no good reason Apple needs to completely control the devices it sells. And as for viruses & shizzle, Macs & popular Linux distros ‘just work’. If a platform is well designed, expensive 3rd party security software shouldn’t be necessary. I would rather an open market, and be required to use some common sense, than a closed market mothered by Apple that has only one porn genre. I think the average luser is ready for that.

]]> By: BigWhale http://www.nixiepixel.com/open-source-phone/comment-page-1/#comment-3051 BigWhale Fri, 26 Feb 2010 12:52:43 +0000 http://www.nixiepixel.com/?p=972#comment-3051 These two things are both needed in balance. Unfortunately nobody knows what the correct balance is. :) I know for a few OSS projects that need complete re-haul, PHP and Wordpress are good examples. ;) These two things are both needed in balance. Unfortunately nobody knows what the correct balance is. :)

I know for a few OSS projects that need complete re-haul, PHP and WordPress are good examples. ;)

]]> By: Russ http://www.nixiepixel.com/open-source-phone/comment-page-1/#comment-3049 Russ Fri, 26 Feb 2010 00:26:33 +0000 http://www.nixiepixel.com/?p=972#comment-3049 Justin, I agree that OSS as a conscious choice is just a geek thing and the average joe couldn't care less, but I disagree with your evaluation and justification of the Apple way of doing things. I read recently in an article (http://www.informationweek.com/blog/main/archives/2008/03/jobs_flash_not.html;jsessionid=YM50NQ435E4PVQE1GHOSKH4ATMY32JVN) that the reason Steve Jobs hasn't yet included flash on the iPhone has nothing to do with whether or not it is a source of vulnerability. He hasn't included it because it performs sluggishly on the iPhone. And as far as the process apps have to go through to get into the app store being better, I don't really see any proof of that being the case. The app mentioned in Nixie's article hasn't had any reports of crashing anyone's iPhone and yet it was apparently removed which stinks more of censorship. I'll stick with an OS that allows me to choose whether or not I want to install an app rather than choosing for me whether or not the app is appropriate, thanks. Justin, I agree that OSS as a conscious choice is just a geek thing and the average joe couldn’t care less, but I disagree with your evaluation and justification of the Apple way of doing things. I read recently in an article (http://www.informationweek.com/blog/main/archives/2008/03/jobs_flash_not.html;jsessionid=YM50NQ435E4PVQE1GHOSKH4ATMY32JVN) that the reason Steve Jobs hasn’t yet included flash on the iPhone has nothing to do with whether or not it is a source of vulnerability. He hasn’t included it because it performs sluggishly on the iPhone. And as far as the process apps have to go through to get into the app store being better, I don’t really see any proof of that being the case. The app mentioned in Nixie’s article hasn’t had any reports of crashing anyone’s iPhone and yet it was apparently removed which stinks more of censorship. I’ll stick with an OS that allows me to choose whether or not I want to install an app rather than choosing for me whether or not the app is appropriate, thanks.

]]> By: Justin "Trip" Drew http://www.nixiepixel.com/open-source-phone/comment-page-1/#comment-3048 Justin "Trip" Drew Thu, 25 Feb 2010 22:20:04 +0000 http://www.nixiepixel.com/?p=972#comment-3048 The gluttony of choice is definitely a hindrance to mass adoption of OSS operating systems but I think another issue is this idea of "not reinventing the wheel." Although I think that's a good concept to live by, I think it's also good sometimes to completely start from scratch, forget all your preconceived notions and reinvent the wheel. You could make it better. The gluttony of choice is definitely a hindrance to mass adoption of OSS operating systems but I think another issue is this idea of “not reinventing the wheel.” Although I think that’s a good concept to live by, I think it’s also good sometimes to completely start from scratch, forget all your preconceived notions and reinvent the wheel. You could make it better.

]]> By: Justin "Trip" Drew http://www.nixiepixel.com/open-source-phone/comment-page-1/#comment-3047 Justin "Trip" Drew Thu, 25 Feb 2010 22:16:46 +0000 http://www.nixiepixel.com/?p=972#comment-3047 This goes back to what I was saying below. Average Joe doesn't see their phone as a mini-computer, they see it as a phone, a device that they turn on and use when needed. As such, the device needs to be reliable and convenient. That's why you don't see many non-geeks carrying around a smart phone, until the iPhone came out and made it easy. This goes back to what I was saying below. Average Joe doesn’t see their phone as a mini-computer, they see it as a phone, a device that they turn on and use when needed. As such, the device needs to be reliable and convenient. That’s why you don’t see many non-geeks carrying around a smart phone, until the iPhone came out and made it easy.

]]> By: Justin "Trip" Drew http://www.nixiepixel.com/open-source-phone/comment-page-1/#comment-3046 Justin "Trip" Drew Thu, 25 Feb 2010 22:13:27 +0000 http://www.nixiepixel.com/?p=972#comment-3046 I'm torn on this subject. On one hand, I love my iPhone and using OS X, but on the other hand I also love using Linux and am an OSS promoter. The problem comes when you are strictly one or the other I think. The main point that you're missing with having an OSS mobile operating system like Android is that 99% of users could care less if their phone uses an open-source or closed-source operating system, they just want their device to work, to do what it claims to do, and to do so in a reasonably quick and crash-free experience. That's where I think Apple has it right. The reason why they won't allow Flash is because it's a huge source of vulnerability for the underlying operating system and is prone to cause crashes because of it's flakiness. The same ideology comes into play for their application approval process. They verify that it runs stably, doesn't interfere with other apps, don't cause the phone to drop to a crawl and provides the user a good experience while still abiding by their guidelines. You would also hope that this would prevent a lot of cruft and useless applications littering the application store, but that seems to be hit or miss unfortunately. Without the same approval process, such as on Android, you have issues with some applications that aren't as clean and polished as ones on the iPhone. I've even heard of some crashing the entire phone. This has only ever happened on my iPhone with applications that I got through jailbreaking and I knew would most likely cause the phone to crash. I personally think that OSS really is just a geek thing and the average joe could care less and only cares that their device works smoothly and reliably. I’m torn on this subject. On one hand, I love my iPhone and using OS X, but on the other hand I also love using Linux and am an OSS promoter. The problem comes when you are strictly one or the other I think. The main point that you’re missing with having an OSS mobile operating system like Android is that 99% of users could care less if their phone uses an open-source or closed-source operating system, they just want their device to work, to do what it claims to do, and to do so in a reasonably quick and crash-free experience. That’s where I think Apple has it right. The reason why they won’t allow Flash is because it’s a huge source of vulnerability for the underlying operating system and is prone to cause crashes because of it’s flakiness. The same ideology comes into play for their application approval process. They verify that it runs stably, doesn’t interfere with other apps, don’t cause the phone to drop to a crawl and provides the user a good experience while still abiding by their guidelines. You would also hope that this would prevent a lot of cruft and useless applications littering the application store, but that seems to be hit or miss unfortunately. Without the same approval process, such as on Android, you have issues with some applications that aren’t as clean and polished as ones on the iPhone. I’ve even heard of some crashing the entire phone. This has only ever happened on my iPhone with applications that I got through jailbreaking and I knew would most likely cause the phone to crash.
I personally think that OSS really is just a geek thing and the average joe could care less and only cares that their device works smoothly and reliably.

]]> By: Kifa http://www.nixiepixel.com/open-source-phone/comment-page-1/#comment-3044 Kifa Thu, 25 Feb 2010 21:04:55 +0000 http://www.nixiepixel.com/?p=972#comment-3044 Xen has a good point here - Android is not the only, and for sure not the best smartphone operating system out there. And yea - neither of the three major players in the field - Maemo and Symbian in addition to the aforementioned - is perfect and it's hard to choose one. But still it's at least good to mention the others. And no, I don't think that Android will be everywhere - Maemo is far more advanced, just look at what it doeas on N900, and Symbian is already a mature system with large developer and user base. Android has hype, and in most cases nothing else to offer in comparison with the two, so... The same goes for the horrible mistake CromeOS is going to be, but that's another thing. Overall - I think that the system should be secure first, then we should educate the users about the risks of installing unprooven software and giving it privileges on our OS, and only apply minimal controll over which apps can be released and which can't. And for Apple introducing selective censorship based on how much the particular developer pays them to pass the certification - well, as you say, a shot in the foot. With both barrels. Xen has a good point here – Android is not the only, and for sure not the best smartphone operating system out there. And yea – neither of the three major players in the field – Maemo and Symbian in addition to the aforementioned – is perfect and it’s hard to choose one. But still it’s at least good to mention the others.

And no, I don’t think that Android will be everywhere – Maemo is far more advanced, just look at what it doeas on N900, and Symbian is already a mature system with large developer and user base. Android has hype, and in most cases nothing else to offer in comparison with the two, so… The same goes for the horrible mistake CromeOS is going to be, but that’s another thing.

Overall – I think that the system should be secure first, then we should educate the users about the risks of installing unprooven software and giving it privileges on our OS, and only apply minimal controll over which apps can be released and which can’t. And for Apple introducing selective censorship based on how much the particular developer pays them to pass the certification – well, as you say, a shot in the foot. With both barrels.

]]> By: BigWhale http://www.nixiepixel.com/open-source-phone/comment-page-1/#comment-3043 BigWhale Thu, 25 Feb 2010 12:28:24 +0000 http://www.nixiepixel.com/?p=972#comment-3043 One of the problems of open source is that we're trying to build a car with 22 different wheels. ;) Some competition is ok, but not too much. I'd rather have one good sound framework for Linux instead three of them all a bit buggy. :) One of the problems of open source is that we’re trying to build a car with 22 different wheels. ;)

Some competition is ok, but not too much. I’d rather have one good sound framework for Linux instead three of them all a bit buggy. :)

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